【键盘侠】雄鹿不该放布罗格登？|他或许被大家高估了
2019-09-29 19:51:26 来源：CCTV5在线直播
[The Jump] Zach Lowe: "Giannis did his job. Eric Bledsoe did not do his job and the second best player on their team in that series was Malcolm Brogdon. Ownership did not do their job retaining him and he's on another team now..."
NBA名记Zach Lowe日前在节目中谈到了雄鹿在季后赛对猛龙表现：“字母哥做好了分内之事。布莱德索没有完成任务，他们那轮系列赛第二好的球员是布罗格登。雄鹿管理层工作不到位，没能留住他，他现在在其他队了……”
————————
[–]76ers IndigoJacob 755 指標 2 天前*
Cant disagree. Why keep the 29 year old PG that cant shoot, instead of the 26 year old PG who almost shot 43% from deep.
Edit : Just so everyone knows, Milwaukee wasnt choosing between the two. They could of had both. The reality of it is, they were choosing between Brogdon + tax, or George Hill. They cheaped out and chose George Hill.
What they actually did, choosing Hill and money over Brogdon, is about 5x worse than just choosing Bledsoe over Brogdon.
76人球迷：我就不同意雄鹿的做法。为啥要留一个没有投射的29岁控卫，而不留那个三分命中率43%的26岁控卫呢？
编辑：你们得知道，雄鹿之前不是在布莱德索和布罗格登之间做选择，他们是可以两个都留下的。现实是，他们要在布罗格登+税费和乔治-希尔之间做选择。然后他们贪便宜，选择了希尔。
他们这种操作比选择布莱德索而不是布罗格登还要烂五倍。
[–]Heat jbenson255 94 指標 2 天前
Brogdon is definitely a much better fit next to giannis.
热火球迷：比起布莱德索，布罗格登在字母哥身边肯定更适合的多。
[–]Jazz Vordeo 114 指標 2 天前
That extension made no sense at the time, and tbh Brodgon balling out in the playoffs just made the decision even worse.
爵士球迷：雄鹿早早续约布莱德索想不通啊，说实话，布罗格登在季后赛的亮眼显得雄鹿的决定更加愚蠢。
[–][BOS] Jaylen Brown OrangeKookie 165 指標 2 天前
Bledsoe was balling out at the time of the extension but the bucks didn't foresee he'd be a massive choker in the playoffs although he did just choke vs Scary Terry the previous playoffs
凯尔特人球迷：布莱德索续约那段时间打得很好啊，可是雄鹿也没法预料到他会在季后赛掉链子啊，虽说他去年在季后赛碰到罗齐尔的时候也掉过一次链子。
[–]76ers swaldron 57 指標 2 天前
The deal was considered steal when it happened, only recently has it been considered a mistake
76人球迷：雄鹿续约布莱德索的时候你们都说雄鹿占便宜了，只有最近你们才说那是个错误。
[–][MIL] Thon Maker Short_Bus_ 485 指標 2 天前*
For lots of reasons.
1) Reports have made it fairly clear Brogdon wanted to go elsewhere so he could be a starting PG.
2) His best position isn’t PG, in reality he’s best used like a small wing player at the 2. He’s an average at best defender at the 1 and a well below average playmaker at the 1.
3) He’s terrible at running the fastbreak, I can recall dozens and dozens of times he’s fucked up in transition by not passing to a wide open Giannis (or other player, but it’s usually Giannis).
4) He shoots the 3 at a great percentage, but his volume is super low and almost all of those 3s are taken open and from above the break while wide open.
5) If we matched the Pacers offer we couldn’t have brought back Lopez or Hill. Lopez was 10x more impactful than Brogdon last season, and Hill was probably better than Brogdon in the Raptors series and was stud against the Cs whom we didn’t even need Brogdon to beat.
6) We got a first and 2 seconds from the Pacers for the sign and trade. (Which we badly need as we don’t have many traceable future picks)
7) The guys we signed to fill in for Brogdon at the 2 (Matthews, Korver) aren’t as good as him, but will probably average 2 or 3x the 3pt attempts per minute that Brogdon would.
8) Bledsoe was a much better player than Brogdon last season, excluding those 6 games vs the Raps. His extension was for less than market value, and happened long before those 6 aforementioned games.
9) Yes Bledsoe is a bad shooter for the 1, but in practically every other way he’s the perfect PG to pair with Giannis.
10) I have no doubt Brogdon was well liked by the players, but there’s no way the locker room would have chosen to keep Brog instead Bled if they voted on it survivor style or some shit like that. He’s beloved in that locker room.
I loved Brogdon as a Buck and will continue to be a fan, but this narrative is all media bullshit being drummed up so they can pretend they think Giannis isn’t happy about this and tangentially talk about his free agency.
雄鹿球迷：我们不留布罗格登的原因很多。
1、那些报道已经很明显了，布罗格登之前就想换队打首发控卫。
2、他的最佳位置不是控卫，实际上他最佳的位置是在2号位被当做小个侧翼使用。他在一号位的防守很平庸，组织能力更是低于水准线。
3、他下快攻的能力很菜，他在快攻的时候因为没传给空当下的字母哥而搞砸，这种画面我能想到很多次。
4、他的三分命中率是很好，可是他的出手数很低啊，而且那些三分几乎都是大空位啊。
5、如果我们匹配了步行者的报价，那我们就留不了大洛或希尔。洛佩兹上赛季的作用是布罗格登的10倍，而且打猛龙的那轮系列赛里，希尔的表现或许比布罗格登好吧，打凯尔特人的时候更是爆种了，那会儿我们甚至都没派上布罗格登。
6、我们从与步行者的交易里得到了一个首轮和两个次轮签。
7、我们在2号位签来的用于顶替布罗格登的球员确实不如他，但是他每分钟出手三分的次数可能会是布罗格登的两三倍啊。
8、布莱德索上赛季的表现比布罗格登强很多啊，甚至包括和猛龙的六场季后赛。血布的合同也低于市场价值。
9、是，布莱德索在1号位来讲投射不行，不过几乎从其他各个方面来说，他搭档字母哥是很完美的。
10、球员都很喜欢布罗格登，这点我没有疑问，不过要是让更衣室投票选的话，他们肯定不会说在他和布莱德索之间优先留他。
我之前很喜欢布罗格登，以后也是。但媒体老喜欢挑事，所以他们就能假想出字母哥对此不开心，顺带谈到他的自由市场选择。
[–]Clippers PM_ME_UR_BEST_STORY_ 80 指標 2 天前
This is a fantastic explanation. I think people just see his jump shooting efficiency and ignore that that's almost exclusively off the catch and shoot
快船球迷：这个解释很厉害。我觉得大家只看到了布罗格登的跳投效率，但是没注意到的是，那几乎都是接球出手。
[–]Knicks johnhenryirons 30 指標 2 天前
And that a TON of those shots were wide open with defenders more than 6 feet away from him.
尼克斯球迷：而且那些进球很多都是大空位，防守人离他6尺开外。
[–]Bucks Bucksin06 73 指標 2 天前
Bledsoe made first all nba defense. I think a lot of people forget how much of an impact Bledsoe made on defense for this team all season. The Bucks would not have had the great season without him.
雄鹿球迷：布莱德索还进了最佳防守一阵呢。我觉得很多人都忘了，血布整个赛季在这支球队的影响力之大。要是没有他，雄鹿上个赛季不会那么出色。
[–]Bucks citipatibuddy 24 指標 2 天前
Even when his shot didn't fall, we needed him on the court for D.
雄鹿球迷：哪怕他投篮进不了，我们也需要他在场上的防守。
[–]Celtics HighlighterTed 24 指標 2 天前
To be fair, Bledsoe can still redeem himself. He had a really good regular season and a lot of Bucks fans thought he should of gotten the all-star nod over Middleton. If he can just avoid sucking in critical playoff series like he has the past two seasons...
凯尔特人球迷：有一说一，布莱德索还能救赎自我。他上赛季常规赛打得真的好，很多雄鹿球迷都觉得进全明星的应该是他，而不是米德尔顿。要是他能不再像之前两个赛季一样，在季后赛里歇菜……
————————
[–]Cavaliers Somali_Kamikaze 1194 指標 2 天前
I don't think I've seen anyone criticise Khris Middleton for some reason.
骑士球迷：也不知为啥，我咋觉得没看过有谁批评米德尔顿呢。
[–]Thunder Datguywelbs089 1113 指標 2 天前
Yep 13ppg in the ECF gets him 180 million? Lmfao
雷霆球迷：是啊，东决13分的均分还能拿到1.8亿的大合同，笑掉大牙啊。
[–]Raptors 100MScoville 23 指標 2 天前
calling it 13ppg is doing him a favour lol, he had like 30 in game 2 then vanished the remainder of the series
猛龙球迷：说是场均13分都便宜他了，他在G2拿了大概30分，然后其余比赛全部消失。
[–]Magic phantomchip 53 指標 2 天前
He was ass in the FIBA Tournament too
魔术球迷：他在世界杯上也是稀烂。
[–]Bucks panick21 30 指標 2 天前
Lol. People were shitting on him all over the place. His world cup performance alone got people talking.
雄鹿球迷：哈哈哈，你们到处喷他。光是他的世界杯表现就有的说了。
[–]Spurs Thehelloman0 21 指標 2 天前
It was crazy to me how Kemba and the celtics got basically all of the criticism when another all star was on the team playing like crap
马刺球迷：美国队世界杯表现垃圾，可是基本只有沃克和那帮凯尔特人球员被喷，其他明星却没啥事，这也真是离奇。
[–]Heat jbenson255 409 指標 2 天前
That contract is still terrible to me but i guess like everyone said the bucks didn’t really have a choice
热火球迷：我现在都觉得米德尔顿的那个合同很水，我记得大家都说雄鹿当时没得选吧。
[–]Clippers PM_ME_UR_BEST_STORY_ 220 指標 2 天前
It's similar to the Tobias contract in my mind. Probably a bit of an overpay, but worth it to retain the talent
快船球迷：他这个情况我觉得和哈里斯很像。或许是有点给高了，但是为了留住这种天赋，也算值得。
[–]Bulls colinmhayes2 231 指標 2 天前
Philly absolutely should not have given Tobias that much.
公牛球迷：76人真不该给哈里斯那么多。
[–]Spurs elmoismyboy 26 指標 2 天前
paying a 27 year old forward who can shoot 40% from 3 and average 20 PPG is not that bad of a decision.
马刺球迷：给一个三分命中率40%、场均20分的27岁锋线那么多，这个决定也没那么不堪。
[–][PHI] Joel Embiid thejayzul 198 指標 2 天前
I am not sure what else we should have done. You aren't wrong, that contract scares me, but we were really lacking in options.
76人球迷：我也不确定我们还有啥选择。你说的也没错，哈里斯那个合同吓到我了，但是我们还真是没得选。
[–]Clippers PM_ME_UR_BEST_STORY_ 77 指標 2 天前
I agree with this view. It could easily look like an albatross in a few years, but if it doesn't hurt your ability to keep Simmons/Embiid and you wouldn't be able to sign anyone you didn't have the bird rights of, I think it's smart
快船球迷：我同意这种观点。过两年再看，这个合同很可能是个麻烦。但是这能帮助你们留住西蒙斯、恩比德，而且你们也没法签下那些你们没有鸟权的球员。我觉得你们这个决定很聪明。
[–][PHI] Joel Embiid thejayzul 25 指標 2 天前
Yep, I like Tobi. I think he's a good player. He's not a max player yet, but I suppose he can grow into one. He's "only" just turned 27 so the contract covers his entire prime and no doubt he can improve. This will be the first time in his career where he's getting some kind of continuity in staying with the same team for an extended period. Though, like you said, it has the potential to look like a really bad contract in a couple of years.
76人球迷：是的，我喜欢哈里斯。我觉得他很强。他还不是那种顶薪球员，不过我觉得他会进步到那个地步。他“才”刚满27，所以新的合同期涵盖了他的整个巅峰期，他肯定会进步的。这也将是他生涯首次得以续约后留在同一支队。不过正如楼上所说，这个合同过几年再看也有沦为垃圾合同的可能性。
[–][CLE] Collin Sexton nvduhn 49 指標 2 天前
Yeah you max Embiid and Simmons no doubt which doesn't leave you with a ton of money to grab talent. People put a ton of value on the contracts but they could only replace Tobias with like an 8m guy at best. His contract is a lot but his value over his replacement player is huge. Idk who philly can even afford to sign with a maxed Simmons and Emiid
其实球迷：是的，你们顶薪留了恩比德和西蒙斯，肯定没有多少钱吸引其他天赋了。很多人很看重合同的价值，可是76人要是不留哈里斯，那就只能用最多值800万年薪的人替他了。他的合同很大，不过他自身的价值比起替代者也很大啊。
[–][MIL] Sterling Brown ElbowDown 18 指標 2 天前
everyone rips on Middleton for is meh offence numbers but keep forgetting that he is a really good defender
雄鹿球迷：你们都因为米德尔顿的进攻数据而喷他，可是都忘了他的防守真的很强。
[–][WAS] Courtney Alexander heyrak 21 指標 2 天前
Because he's really slipped on defense last year. It could have been an aberration, and the Bucks team defense covered it nicely, because the other four starters are anywhere from very good, to absolutely dominant on D, but Middleton wasn't the really good defender he was earlier in his career. I hope he can get back to it this year.
奇才球迷：因为他上赛季在防守端真的下滑了啊。或许是异常，而且有雄鹿的整体防守兜底，因为其他四个雄鹿首发要么防守不错，要么有绝对统治力。但是米德尔顿真不是生涯初期那个防守好的他了。希望他这个赛季能找回状态吧。
[–]Talentagentfriend 29 指標 2 天前
Dude was an All-Star too
这哥们儿还是个全明星呢。
[–]Rockets LikeAGregJennings 46 指標 2 天前
Middleton is one of those all-stars that nobody really thinks of as an actual all-star.
火箭球迷：米德尔顿是那种没人把他当全明星的全明星。
[–]Lakers Pardonme23 17 指標 2 天前
Siakam wasn't and he balled out in the playoffs. Fringe all star appearances are overrated. D'lo vs Siakam, who had the better playoffs?
湖人球迷：西亚卡姆没进全明星，但是季后赛闪光了。边缘全明星的亮相真没那么了不起。就比如说拉塞尔和西亚卡姆，谁季后赛表现更好？
[–][LAL] Alex Caruso efrench8 24 指標 2 天前
Middleton should have been an All star 2 years ago. Last year wasn’t really an all star caliber season
湖人球迷：米德尔顿两年前该进全明星。上赛季真没到那个级别。
[–]Raptors Konfliction 46 指標 2 天前
Middleton does have a bit of that clutch gene tho, which I can't say about Bledsoe. I remember at some points in the ECF it felt like only him and Lopez were getting shots to go down.
猛龙球迷：不过米德尔顿有点大心脏啊，我觉得这点是布莱德索没有的吧。我记得在东决某些时刻，好像只有他和洛佩兹能得分。
[–]Knicks HokageEzio 13 指標 2 天前
Celtic killer.
尼克斯球迷：毕竟绿军克星。
[–]Poopcie 29 指標 2 天前*
He's a career 18 ppg scorer. I'm not sure what people are expecting out of him but he might never be that.
他生涯均分有18分啊。我不知道你们对他有啥期待，不过他或许永远达不到。
————————
[–]Bulls BigPoppaPuff 379 指標 2 天前
Man anyone else think Brogdon's become a bit overrated?
公牛球迷：天呐，还有谁觉得布罗格登有点被高估了吗？
[–]Celtics Conor27 33 指標 2 天前
I really like him as a player, but that contract was a bit much and now the consensus on this sub seems to be that Brogdon was the third-best player on the Bucks last season while a good amount think he was the second-best player on the team last year lol.
Anyone who has that opinion only watched the Bucks in the ECF last year and didn't watch them before the playoffs.
凯尔特人球迷：我喜欢这个球员，不过他那个合同有点多了，现在论坛里一致的共识貌似是，布罗格登是雄鹿上赛季第三强点，还有很多人觉得他是第二强，哈哈哈
这么说的人肯定只看了上赛季的东决，没看他们季后赛之前的表现。
[–]Bucks panick21 20 指標 2 天前
Yes. Specially that people think he is some sort of great PG. He literally almost never played PG because when he was the primary creater he was not great. He is bad in transition. He doesn't really shoot of the dribble and is not passing out of drives.
雄鹿球迷：是啊，居然还有人觉得他有点顶尖控卫的感觉。他其实就没怎么打控卫，因为当他主控时，真没啥创造力。他的攻防转换很差。他也不怎么运球后出手，也不会突分。
[–]Raptors JKirbs14 204 指標 2 天前
Yes, considering the fact that people make him out to be some sort of sniper from deep, but he has a pretty slow release on his j so you can’t really count on him for a high volume of attempts from out there.
Nice spot up shooter, secondary ball handler and defender though.
猛龙球迷：对啊，很多人还觉得他是那种外围狙击手，可是他的出手很慢啊，所以你真不能指望他三分出手次数很多。
他是个很棒的定点投手，不过控球和防守是第二档的。
[–]Raptors BUNSHICHl 94 指標 2 天前
almost sounds like the perfect fit next to a high usage ball handling two guard like oladipo
猛龙球迷：那这听着很适合奥拉迪波这种需要球权的双能卫啊。
[–]Bucks dusters 32 指標 2 天前
It would be a better fit next to a high usage ball handling point guard. Brogdon defends much better at the 2.
雄鹿球迷：他和一个占球权的持球控卫更搭。布罗格登打2号位的防守好很多。
[–]dropdatdurkadurk 9 指標 2 天前
He's honestly in many ways an undersized 3. Not great moving laterally he actually did a real solid job guarding Kawhi in the ECF alot better than Middleton.
说实话，他很多方面来看就像是个小号的3号位。横向移动不算出色，但他在东决对小卡的防守真的很不错，比米德尔顿好很多。
————————
[–][IND] Danny Granger Hendo8888 111 指標 2 天前
And we thank them for it
步行者球迷：所以我们感谢雄鹿啊。
[–]Bucks lundej16 83 指標 2 天前
Four contested threes last year.
Four.
He’s a great guy and great complementary player, but there’s a reason we let you pay him $20m without putting up a fight. I’ll eat my words if I’m wrong, because I do love the guy and have no bad feelings about the Pacers, but everything I’ve ever seen about Malcolm suggests he’s gonna be a much less enthralling player with the ball in his hands all the time.
雄鹿球迷：上赛季他只进了四个有对抗的三分啊！四个啊！
他是个好人，也是个很棒的功能性球员，可是我们不是无缘无故不做任何争取就让你们以2000万年薪得到他的。我喜欢布罗格登，对步行者也没有恶意，可是就我所了解的布罗格登来说，一直有球在手的他将会魅力大减。
[–]Pacers MindofShadow 93 指標 2 天前
dude we started darren collision lol
步行者球迷：老哥，我们之前的首发控卫可是达伦-科里森啊，哈哈
[–]Bucks lundej16 27 指標 2 天前
Well I mean I understand why you wanted him. He’s definitely gonna be an upgrade for you and he should fit much better in your system than ours.
It’s just that I’ve seen a lot of people expecting him to suddenly turn into an all-star, without realizing his success here had a lot to do with being the 4th option, being paired with a bit like Brook who can’t be left alone on the perimeter either, and Giannis constantly having to be triple teamed.
雄鹿球迷：嗯，我理解你们为啥想要他。他对你们来说肯定是升级了，而且他在你们的体系下要适合得多。
只是呢，我看到很多人期望他马上蜕变成一名全明星球员，可是他们没注意到的是，他之前的成功与他是球队的第四选择有很大关系，他的身边有一个具备外线威胁的大洛，还有一个总能吸引三人包夹的字母哥啊。
[–]ridersofrohangarg 47 指標 2 天前
Here we go the mass media fucking over another small market team
媒体抛出这个话题，就是想欺负小球会。
[–]Jazz vizkan 22 指標 2 天前
The media believes small market teams exist solely to develop players and then funnel them to big market teams.
爵士球迷：那些媒体觉得小球会存在的唯一目的就是培养球员，然后往大球会输送。
[–]Poland Weed233 209 指標 2 天前
MVP : drops 22.7 PPG on 51.8 TS% including 58% from FT Line
Media : he did his job
MVP在东决的表现：场均22.7分，真实命中率51.8%，罚篮命中率58%。
媒体：他做了分内之事。
[–]Clippers PM_ME_UR_BEST_STORY_ 11 指標 2 天前
Yeah that Toronto series really made me feel like Giannis has become overrated. Against some teams he's unstoppable, but he's really not that effective against teams that are equipped to stop his drives like Toronto was
快船球迷：是啊，雄鹿打猛龙的那轮系列赛真让我觉得字母哥被高估了。对某些球队的时候，他是不可阻挡的，不过面对猛龙这种可以限制他突破的球队时，他真没那么高效。
[–]Rockets BrallyTX 54 指標 2 天前
Right? Harden got 31.6 ppg on 56.7 TS% on 83% from free throw and he gets torched as choking this year.
I mean yeah, his numbers aren't as good as regular season but they are still damn good.
Giannis gets special treatment.
火箭球迷：对吧，哈登季后赛场均31.6分，真实命中率56.7%，罚篮83%，然后还被喷说季后赛歇菜。
是，他的数据确实不如常规赛，可特么还是很强啊。
字母哥就能得到特别对待。
[–]Warriors HanlonsRazors 10 指標 2 天前
Steph the same way. 30 ppg on 60% TS in the finals and he's a choker too
勇士球迷：库里也是的，总决均分30，真实命中率60%，还被喷不行。
[–]Magic KanyeMelon 7 指標 2 天前
just wait till Giannis is a Star for 3-5 years the haters will come
魔术球迷：再等个三五年吧，字母哥成了超巨，喷子就来了。
[–]Raptors Utkarshgupta28 107 指標 2 天前
He was their scariest player. We had to constantly put up a damn wall with Kawhi and Gasol. Yes, he could have done better but his teammates let him down. I know Giannis did his job cause everytime he had the ball, my butt would clench in fear.
猛龙球迷：他在东决就是雄鹿最可怕的球员，我们得不断用卡哇伊和小加来做特么的墙。对，他是该表现更好些，可是他的队友辜负了他啊。我知道字母哥是做了分内事的，因为他每次一拿球，我就菊花一紧。
[–][MIL] Tony Snell Gups333 24 指標 2 天前
The defense doesnt affect his free throw shooting. He has to be better, as does the rest of the team too
雄鹿球迷：可是你们的防守不能影响到他的罚球吧。他真该表现更好些，其他人也是。
[–]Nets Kwilly462[ ] 10 指標 2 天前
It won't surprise me in the slightest if Giannis leaves Milwaukee. I'm sure he likes the team and the city, but he's not gonna hesitate to dip if he feel things are staying stagnant.
篮网球迷：要是字母哥离开雄鹿，我压根就不会奇怪。我确信他喜欢雄鹿和密尔沃基，可如果他觉得球队停滞不前，那他会毫不犹豫的走人的。
[–]Bucks DamienSalvation 31 指標 2 天前
Things haven't been stagnant so far. He's gone from being on the literal worst team in the league to two games short of the NBA Finals. Just can't regress at this point.
雄鹿球迷：我们也没闲着啊。我们从联盟最菜球队变成了离总决赛只差两场的球队。只是现在不能再退回去了。
[–]76ers PatBurrellTheMachine 26 指標 2 天前
People are starting to get overly dramatic about this Brogdon loss. They’re still going to be the #1 seed in the East and probably the favorite to reach the Finals.
76人球迷：很多人对布罗格登的离队大惊小怪。可雄鹿还会是东部第一，或许还是进入总决的大热门。
————————
来源：Reddit
编译：云长刮个痧